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Latest Upgrade - Poor Experience, I don't care much for the new 'threaded' BS
 
#1
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I've rolled back to 10.5.2 because frankly 11 is more trouble than it is worth.

1 : Almost none stop hard drive activity
2 : failure to display some threads in preview - screen blank

3 : crashing when double clicking a thread - because it wouldn't display in preview
4 : mixing up of all the sent and received items made it impossible to view sensibly - wasn't clear which was which
5 : inability through any option to disable this mode
6 : impossible to manage the way the thread was assembled or presented


Anyone else encountered some of these issues - I do have some others but these are the main gripes - I am not new to TheBat - been using it since version 2 !! - I'm trusting RitLabs to resolve this but I won't be doing any more paid upgrades until it is - and yes I already paid for 11.
 
 
 
#2
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Neil Kirkland wrote:
I've rolled back to 10.5.2 because frankly 11 is more trouble than it is worth.
Welcome to the club.

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Neil Kirkland wrote:
1 : Almost none stop hard drive activity
Yes, see here: https://www.ritlabs.com/en/auth-forums/forum4/topic16259/

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Neil Kirkland wrote:
2 : failure to display some threads in preview - screen blank
I've experienced this. Could be caused by the index from item #1 not being built to completion (just my guess).

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Neil Kirkland wrote:
3 : crashing when double clicking a thread - because it wouldn't display in preview
Similar crashes were reported in several topics here.

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Neil Kirkland wrote:
4 : mixing up of all the sent and received items made it impossible to view sensibly - wasn't clear which was which
This is actually a feature - the new message viewer is called conversation view and aims to display complete interactions (threads).

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Neil Kirkland wrote:
5 : inability through any option to disable this mode
It can be disabled: Options -> Preferences... -> Viewer/Editor -> Use Classic Preview Pane. But it does not disable the indexing from item #1.

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Neil Kirkland wrote:
6 : impossible to manage the way the thread was assembled or presented
True. I sent suggestions to support how to improve on that. See the link under item #1.

I'm speaking for v11.0.2, and 11.0.3 just came out today but I already rolled back. I won't be returning to v11 until at least the indexing issues from #1 are resolved. And to one-up you, I've been using TB since version 1  :)  
 
 
 
#3
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Hello!
I am also having the following issues 1-6. I do assume they are connected with this new view for the emails.
As mentioned in this topic before
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It can be disabled: Options -> Preferences... -> Viewer/Editor -> Use Classic Preview Pane. But it does not disable the indexing from item #1.
but this doesn't fix the blank screen for me, which is very frustrating.
I was able to fix it by both using the mentioned above classic preview pane and by disabling the Auto-View (Workspace->Message Auto view (Shift+Ctrl+E)).
After that i was able to open all emails without a blank screen issue.
Hope this could help someone while the fix is on the way.
 
 
 
#4
2.2267  
I was thinking about doing a thorough uninstall of 11.x [using Total Uninstall] which has been a disaster for me. I still have "thebat_64_10-5-2-1" on my drive. Is this the last 10.x version and if not can someone provide a link? Naturally, I would do a Backup/Restore first.
 
 
 
#5
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Frederick Smith wrote:
Is this the last 10.x version and if not can someone provide a link?

Yes, there is 10.5.4 version stored in Archived sections of download server. See https://www.ritlabs.com/en/products/thebat/archive-versions.php
 
 
 
#6
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If I use v10.5.4 after using the built-in uninstaller in 11.x, this will preserve all my settings, folders, etc.? Now, if I install v10.5.4, has anyone else that had "Access Violations", experienced the diminish or gone?
 
 
 
#7
2.2286  
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Frederick Smith wrote:
If I use v10.5.4 after using the built-in uninstaller in 11.x, this will preserve all my settings, folders, etc.?
Yes, from my recent experience. Uninstall v11, install v10.5.4 into the same folder and voila, nothing to adjust. Except replacing the pin to taskbar or wherever, this I always need to do manually.

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Frederick Smith wrote:
Now, if I install v10.5.4, has anyone else that had "Access Violations", experienced the diminish or gone?
In the week or so I've been using it, no major bugs showed their face. Very good version in my book, stable as a rock.
 
 
 
#8
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After uninstalling two entries, v11.0.3 and v11.02, installing v10.5.4, and starting TheBat64, I get, TheBat64.exe "The code execution cannot proceed because sqlite3.dll was not found. Reinstalling the program may fix this problem" Also, TheBat64.exe, v11.0.3, is under program files. Isn't this usually installed under users/username/... etc.? And, why v11.0.3 and not v10.5.4? I should have known this was just going to make things more complicated.
EDIT: I could try uninstalling once again. But, the only entry under "Add or Remove Programs" is v10.5.4 now.
Edited: Frederick Smith - 12 January 2024 22:38:51
 
 
 
#9
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Frederick Smith wrote:
After uninstalling two entries, v11.0.3 and v11.02, installing v10.5.4, and starting TheBat64, I get, TheBat64.exe "The code execution cannot proceed because sqlite3.dll was not found. Reinstalling the program may fix this problem" Also, TheBat64.exe, v11.0.3, is under program files. Isn't this usually installed under users/username/... etc.? And, why v11.0.3 and not v10.5.4? I should have known this was just going to make things more complicated.EDIT: I could try uninstalling once again. But, the only entry under "Add or Remove Programs" is v10.5.4 now.

This is a common old problem where the installer doesn't update the shortcuts appropriately and a previously installed version is still lingering somewhere. Make sure you're running the correct TheBat64.exe. It seems you're running the v11 one since v10 doesn't know about SQLite. That's why I mentioned replacing the pin to taskbar, etc. Locate the correct TheBat64.exe file and create pins/shortcuts manually.
Edited: Miloš Radovanović - 13 January 2024 09:27:40
 
 
 
#10
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1. I removed the shortcuts in the Apps menu, desktop, and unpinned the one on the taskbar.
2..
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Uninstall The Bat! v11 via the Control Panel (your user data will be left untouched). Remove the remaining shortcuts and unpin the program from the Taskbar. Then install v10.5.4.

3. This is what I was trying to do. The idea was to run v3.5.4.
4. I need instructions about what how to move forward and achieve the above? This will be by "hand"? The only TheBat64.exe is in the Program Files folder.  
 
 
 
#11
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Frederick Smith wrote:
4. I need instructions about what how to move forward and achieve the above? This will be by "hand"? The only TheBat64.exe is in the Program Files folder.  
Is TheBat64.exe in "Program Files" itself or "Program Files\The Bat!"?

When you right-click on TheBat64.exe and select Properties, what version does it say in the Details tab?

In what folder is your message base?
 
 
 
#12
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Miloš Radovanović wrote:
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Frederick Smith wrote:
4. I need instructions about what how to move forward and achieve the above? This will be by "hand"? The only TheBat64.exe is in the Program Files folder.  
Is TheBat64.exe in "Program Files" itself or "Program Files\The Bat!"?

When you right-click on TheBat64.exe and select Properties, what version does it say in the Details tab?

In what folder is your message base?
"C:\Program Files\The Bat!" The EXE File Version and Product Version are 11.0.3 "C:\Users\fredc\AppData\Roaming\The Bat!" has all my folders and emails. I got used to seeing a "Main" sub-folder in this, but it's not there in this one? Who knows what else is in there.
Edited: Frederick Smith - 13 January 2024 18:49:39
 
 
 
#13
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Frederick Smith wrote:
"C:\Program Files\The Bat!" The EXE File Version and Product Version are 11.0.3 "C:\Users\fredc\AppData\Roaming\The Bat!" has all my folders and emails. I got used to seeing a "Main" sub-folder in this, but it's not there in this one? Who knows what else is in there.

OK, apparently v11 didn't completely go away after the uninstall. I suggest you do the following:

1. Back up the "C:\Users\fredc\AppData\Roaming\The Bat!" folder (just copy it to an external drive or something).
2. Execute the uninstall of any remaining TB versions.
3. If there is anything left in "Program Files\The Bat!", delete it (or move it somewhere else if deletion seems scary).
4. Install v10.5.4 into "Program Files\The Bat!".
5. If needed, manually create pins/shortcuts to "Program Files\The Bat!\TheBat64.exe".
6. Once you run TB, it should recognize all your accounts. If that doesn't happen, create each one again and point TB to the appropriate subfolder in "C:\Users\fredc\AppData\Roaming\The Bat!": Account -> New... -> Restore From... -> Home folder
 
 
 
#14
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Sorry - was responding inappropriately - I installed clean but still there are problems - the other poster has different issues to me I think
Edited: Neil Kirkland - 13 January 2024 22:08:21 (The recommendations made weren't for me ...)
 
 
 
#15
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Miloš Radovanović wrote:
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Frederick Smith wrote:
"C:\Program Files\The Bat!" The EXE File Version and Product Version are 11.0.3 "C:\Users\fredc\AppData\Roaming\The Bat!" has all my folders and emails. I got used to seeing a "Main" sub-folder in this, but it's not there in this one? Who knows what else is in there.

OK, apparently v11 didn't completely go away after the uninstall. I suggest you do the following:

1. Back up the "C:\Users\fredc\AppData\Roaming\The Bat!" folder (just copy it to an external drive or something).
2. Execute the uninstall of any remaining TB versions.
3. If there is anything left in "Program Files\The Bat!", delete it (or move it somewhere else if deletion seems scary).
4. Install v10.5.4 into "Program Files\The Bat!".
5. If needed, manually create pins/shortcuts to "Program Files\The Bat!\TheBat64.exe".
6. Once you run TB, it should recognize all your accounts. If that doesn't happen, create each one again and point TB to the appropriate subfolder in "C:\Users\fredc\AppData\Roaming\The Bat!": Account -> New... -> Restore From... -> Home folder
1. How could TB recognize all the accounts if they are in a "different place"?
2. This procedure in #6 is a bit unclear to me. Is this account specific? I have two accounts: Gmail and Comcast. But, my folders are not directly associated with either folder. I just drag-and-drop messages from the Inbox [for example] into a folder?
3. Finally, are there any moves/copies/etc. that will clash? Usually, when you do some sort of copy like this, date/time can be used or some other criteria?
EDIT: For a long time, I used TB w/o really much of an issue. Whenever I reinstalled it, I just did backup first and then a restore. That's it.
Edited: Frederick Smith - 14 January 2024 00:55:28
 
 
 
#16
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OK, to avoid confusion fr om now on I will refer to folders on disk and directories, and e-mail folders as folders.
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Frederick Smith wrote:
1. How could TB recognize all the accounts if they are in a "different place"?
TB keeps many settings in the Registry, including the location of the data directory it I'm not mistaken. Uninstallers (at least the more recent ones) leave these settings after uninstalling, so a freshly installed TB can continue where the previous one left off.

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Frederick Smith wrote:
2. This procedure in #6 is a bit unclear to me. Is this account specific? I have two accounts: Gmail and Comcast. But, my folders are not directly associated with either folder. I just drag-and-drop messages fr om the Inbox [for example] into a folder?
Sorry, my explanation could have been a bit confusing. As I wrote, usually TB will recognize wh ere your data directory is by using the left-over Registry settings. If that does not happen (I've experienced it a few times over the years), it needs help. What will happen is TB will open the New Account window upon startup, and you will need to select Restore From... -> Home folder and point it to the subdirectory of "C:\Users\fredc\AppData\Roaming\The Bat!" wh ere the account data resides (it should be an immediate subdirectory). Doing it like that for each account separately worked for me. I don't know whether it can recognize all accounts at once if you point it to the "C:\Users\fredc\AppData\Roaming\The Bat!" directory itself, I haven't tried it.

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Frederick Smith wrote:
3. Finally, are there any moves/copies/etc. that will clash? Usually, when you do some sort of copy like this, date/time can be used or some other criteria?
When you do Restore From... -> Home folder nothing gets moved or copied, TB just continues using the data in that directory as a working directory, as before.

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Frederick Smith wrote:
EDIT: For a long time, I used TB w/o really much of an issue. Whenever I reinstalled it, I just did backup first and then a restore. That's it.
Yes, that's also a possibility. However, in this case you could duplicate data on your disk if you import from a backup into a working directory that is different than the one previously used.
 
 
 
#17
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I deleted what was here because I don't have access to Backup/Restore for lack of a working TB. I checked the date on my last backup [TBK] and it was Jan 1, 2024. That's a lot of missing data.
EDIT: This is the ticket I opened. Can you see this I wanted to PM you, but could not figure it out. I am trying to simplify [somehow] what you suggested above. I thought if you could view the ticket so far it would help.
Edited: Frederick Smith - 14 January 2024 23:37:11
 
 
 
#18
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Frederick Smith wrote:
I deleted what was here because I don't have access to Backup/Restore for lack of a working TB. I checked the date on my last backup [TBK] and it was Jan 1, 2024. That's a lot of missing data.EDIT: This is the ticket I opened.  Can you see this  I wanted to PM you, but could not figure it out. I am trying to simplify [somehow] what you suggested above. I thought if you could view the ticket so far it would help.
I can't see the ticket, and PMs seem to be disabled. Feel free to write here.

EDIT: maybe you could try to reinstall v11 (v11.0.3.1 is now available), and do the backup?
Edited: Miloš Radovanović - 15 January 2024 12:40:10
 
 
 
#19
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1. Uninstall all versions of The Bat! via the Control Panel (your user data will be left untouched).
2. Remove the remaining shortcuts and unpin the program from the Taskbar.
3. Delete "The Bat!" folder under C:\Program Files\...\, but only if your mail data folders is stored in another location on the disk.
4. Delete "The Bat!" folder under C:\Users\{UserName}\AppData\Local\...\
5. Install The Bat! v10.5.4.

Which version of The Bat! starts now?
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v10.5.4 starts now. It is under "C:\Program Files\The Bat!". I think some settings under "Viewer/Editor" need to be tweaked? View HTML messages using" and "View Messages with Alternative Layout (Text and HTML)", for example, have no selection. There are some messages that are new and old that have no body under Preview and when message is opened. No AVs so far, "Read as new" is always able to display the body of a message.

From the ticket.
EDIT: Before I update to 11.x [11.0.3.1] again, I gotta have absolute confidence that this will go better than last time.
Edited: Frederick Smith - 16 January 2024 02:23:55
 
 
 
#20
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I don’t have time to list all my problems with and complaints about The Bat! v. 11 now, but I do want to report the worst ones and how I solved a new problem I had after I downgraded from v. 11.0.2 back to 10.5.1 (the one I had been using before upgrading to 11):

COULD NOT READ BODIES OF MESSAGES AFTER I DOWNGRADED TO V. 10.

If they had attachments, such a PDF files, I could see those in the viewer, but I could not read the main message. I remembered that when I started using v.11, and I opened Options | Preferences, trying to find the place to disable Conversation View (never did find it!), I noticed that under Viewer/Editor the choices for “View HTML messages using” and “View messages with alternative layout (Text and HTML) as” were BLANK. I clicked on the dropdown boxes, and nothing appeared, so I closed them and tried to use v. 11.

The biggest problems I had with v. 11 were:

1. When I tried to open one message, I got an access violation. When I tried to forward it, an editing window opened, but the body of the message I was trying to forward was blank, so I could not read it that way, either. I could open the message and read it on the website of my ISP, so I tried forwarding it to an email address which used a different ISP. When I tried to open the message forwarded to the new email address in The Bat!, I again got an access violation. In the past, closing and reopening The Bat! usually solved the access violation problem, but not today.

2. When I tried to open another message, all that displayed was the headers—no body displayed at all.

I uninstalled v.11.0.2 from Control Panel, restarted my computer, and installed 10.5.1 (so glad I use the no-automatic-update versions!). The Bat! opened fine, but when I tried to open individual messages, I only saw the header! If they had a PDF attachment, I could see that, too, in the viewer. But no bodies. For a moment I thought that upgrade had done something to all my messages so they would not open in v. 10!

Then I remembered the blank dropdown boxes. I went to Options | Preferences | Viewer/Editor. The settings I referenced above were still blank, but now when I clicked on the dropdown boxes, several options appeared. I selected “HTML only” for both, clicked O.K., and everything worked.

I don’t know whether Support monitors this Forum, as I have not seen responses from Support to posts here, so I am opening a ticket with the above report.

Edited: chileverde - 16 January 2024 03:19:06
 
 
 
#21
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Frederick Smith wrote:
If I use v10.5.4 after using the built-in uninstaller in 11.x, this will preserve all my settings, folders, etc.? Now, if I install v10.5.4, has anyone else that had "Access Violations", experienced the diminish or gone?
Yes, as mentioned in my long post above, I had one message for which there was an access violation in v. 11.0.2, but after I downgraded to 10.5.1 and made the changes in dropdown boxes described above, I was able to open that message without any trouble. I described in detail how I downgraded. When I re-opened The Bat! in v. 10.5.1, everything (with the exception described in my post above) worked fine. All my folders are preserved—local folders, as well as folders for several accounts with different ISP's. Filters still work. Other settings appear intact. Sorry to hear you are having trouble with your downgrade.
 
 
 
#22
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Miloš Radovanović Any thoughts on the seemingly "missing" bodies of messages?
 
 
 
#23
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Frederick Smith wrote:
Miloš Radovanović  Any thoughts on the seemingly "missing" bodies of messages?
If I remember correctly, this is related to the missing values in the combo boxes for the text and HTML viewers in the Preferences. Apparently it was fixed in v11.0.3, but not in v10.5.4: https://www.ritlabs.com/en/products/thebat/revision-history/8122/

"Combo boxes in the Preferences dialog become empty when moved into a scroll box on smaller screens"

You could try increasing the resolution of your screen.

Another thing to try is setting the registry values manually, see this post: https://www.ritlabs.com/en/auth-forums/forum4/topic16251/message56246/#message56246
 
 
 
#24
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I think some settings under "Viewer/Editor" need to be tweaked? Use Plain Text Messages using is set to "Plain Text Viewer (fast, no graphical smileys). View HTML messages using" and "View Messages with Alternative Layout (Text and HTML)", for example, have no selection. I tried what I thought I read above to for the other two in order here, "HTML Viewer" and "HTML and Plain Text Version".
If there are mistakes here it's because I am so tired and have spent so much time on this. If anyone were able to put together my open Ticket and all my posts here in the forum it would probably make more sense. More to come.
EDIT: {No AVs so far. Message bodies not easily viewed are back to normal}
Edited: Frederick Smith - 16 January 2024 20:03:46
 
 
 
#25
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Frederick Smith wrote:
No AVs so far. Message bodies not easily viewed are back to normal
I'm happy you're finally back to normal, hoping it stays that way. v10.5.4 should serve you well.
 
 
 
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